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Siegfried and Roy
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Janice
Baby Iguana
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Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 23
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 7:01 pm    Post subject: Siegfried and Roy Reply with quote
Being that I am new here. I don't know if the question was asked. I feel that Montecore did attack Roy, simply because it is still a wild animal. I suppose we will never know that actual truth. I was going to Vegas, to see them. Unfortunately, it was not to be. I do applaud them for their conservation of the white tiger....
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tigerdave
Ocelot
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Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 3579
Location: where all the animals are !

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Here something to think about !!! hehe !!! do they really do any conservation or do they just breed the White tigers to keep replaceing the ones that don't want to go on stage ? And how much of their 48 million dollars a year they make from those tigers have they put to good use like to save the tigers in the wild ?

And yes Roy was attacked by that young Tiger !


And welcome to our fourm Janice we have alot of fun and we all learn so much in here and it so good to hear from you !!!

Tigerdave
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Alex
Top Nerd
Top Nerd


Joined: 03 May 2004
Posts: 704
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I like what Dave and Jason told me about these great cats. No matter how CUTE they might look or even if their dispositions appear extremely docile most of the time, they still cannot escape their own instincts at some point(instincts which do NOT include any special privileges for humans). LOL! Over a long enough timeline this kind of increased exposure will almost certainly lead to tragic circumstances. (Re: Dave/Jason)
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vlad
Clouded Leopard
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Joined: 24 Jul 2005
Posts: 2703
Location: Enjoying the CYBER-JUNGLE!

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi Janice Very Happy - We've been nerding hard on the very things you mentioned. Here are links to a some discussions we've had on that very topic, including some discussion & a link to an article concerning pros & cons of the captive breeding issue:

http://tinylinks.net/1052

http://tinylinks.net/1051

Also, below is a link to an really interesting article by Richard Farinato (Richard Farinato is The HSUS's Director of Captive Wildlife Programs and the Wildlife Advocacy Division), discussing the hazards of dealing with big cats in the entertainment industry, as well as addressing the erronous notions that some hold about their abilities to turn these natural born killers into affectionate, trustworthy overgrown housecats!

Farinato discusses the Roy Horn situation in his article.

While it is true that they CAN be affectionate with their owners (or trainers, or keepers) - that can change in a flash - and so can the life of anyone unfortunate enough to forget that there is no separating them from their wild instincts. Confused
http://tinylinks.net/1053

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BarbaraJ
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Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 713
Location: North Carolina

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 6:52 pm    Post subject: Roy Horn Reply with quote
It was actually while doing some research on white tigers as a result of Roy Horn being injured that I found TigerHomes. I used to feel like most people I guess that Siegfried and Roy were great and wonderful and could do no harm. However, after being educated by "Teacher" Dave and the volumes of info on this website, I've seen the error of my ways.

Val, that is an excellent article by Richard Fairnato - going to print that one out for sure.
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tigerdave
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Joined: 07 May 2004
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Location: where all the animals are !

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
30,000 shows now is that not wrong to be putting these tigers through !!! What is wrong with people that think this was a good thing and good for who Roy and Siegfried or for the animals that are forced to go on stage 3 to 4 times a day for years and years !!! Like I said before they breed these Tigers not to save them but to have enough over the years so they can be in 30,000 shows with Lights and fireworks and loud noices and then to be created up and get them ready for the next and the next and the next show each and everyday for profit which brought in 48 million dollars a year !!! Now where did that money go ? Did it go to help save these awesome animals in the wild or did it just go in their bank accounts ? Look at how those guys lived they spent every dollar and lived like KINGS while they say they love tigers but there are tiger Sanctuaries in Vagas that can't make ends meet and these guys are packing them in everyday night in and night out for nothing more then profit and we the public buy the tickets at 150.00 a show to see these animals disapearing in boxes and walked around on stage like a dog and see them chained in place while on the round ball that suspose to be like the world that come up from the stage with the music blarring and the smoke filled room and the trainers are off behind the curtins throwing out meat so the tigers eat while being chained in places and that goes on 3 to 4 time a day 360 days a year and we think this is so AWESOME and how cool that these guys have made these tigers their PETS !!! What a messages they are sending to everyone !!! They are the number one reason people try and want a tiger so they to can make it their PET like ROY and Siegfried has shown the world over and over !!! Look at the videos all they ever show is the tigers walking through the house or sleeping in their bed or Roy riding on their backs etc etc etc !!! They don't have a enough sence to preach that a tiger does not make a good pet and they should never ever be considered a pet ! Where have they done any EDUCATION at all with these tigers or for that matter any animals !!! I have been there and have seen their show and I have watch their videos and have spent a week there a few times and they teach you nothing except how they have these animals has their PET to proform on stage for profit !!!

So i for one is glade their show is over I am not happy that Roy got hurt but that was going to happen sooner or later with the turn over of the Tigers that they use over and over to be able to do 30,000 shows !!! That why they breed the tigers for themself to replace the ones that get tired of doing the show all day long so they alway need no blood because the show must go on !!!!

Now I will say this their tigers are well taken care of that for sure they do get the best of everything but at 48 million a year that at least what those tiger deserve !!! And I will also say this Roy is one heck of a handler and he does have a way with these animals like no one else but that does not help you when they deside to snap and carried you off stage with their teeth in your neck !!!

Jason and i will tell you this we are VERY good and are AWESOME handler and have learned from the best and we have had more close calls and are very lucky to be alive and we have done some amazing things over the years with all sorts of animals including of course all the big Cats !!! And everytime you go in with these animals or try and take them out for what ever reason we are putting our lives in danger !!!

Hey I am sorry this is such a long post and I don't want it to sound like i hate these guys but I just wanted to point another way of looking at what they do and the main Reason PETA and the Animal Rights been protesting their shows for years !!!

This is my story and I sticking to it !!! hehe !!!
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ace1fan
Meerkat
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Joined: 22 Aug 2005
Posts: 1281
Location: TIGERHOMES.ORG!!!!!!

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:41 pm    Post subject: Disappearing Act Reply with quote
AMEN TO THAT POST DAVE

The WORLD doesn't need Smoke & Magic Tricks to make these Tigers disappear Exclamation Seems we have handed them that fate on a silver platter - given collectively without ever buying a ticket Evil or Very Mad

I was in Vegas a few years ago & had the chance to pay these tigers a visit. All my friends could not believe I didnt want to go or buy a ticket Exclamation Why don't you want to go Ace Question Well I told them WHY Exclamation As soon as I got home I sent that $150 to TigerHomes where the animals live out their lives in peace Exclamation Cool

No tricks for TUNDRA & LOKI to line your pockets Shocked Very Happy
No Disappearing Acts at TigerHomes.Org Exclamation Exclamation Exclamation
Thank you Dave Wink


Ace
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tigerdave
Ocelot
Ocelot


Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 3579
Location: where all the animals are !

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I knew you would like that post Ace !!! hehe !!! But that is really the truth about their show and it's time that these kinds of shows are stopped !!! There is no EDUCATION with what they do it just smoke and Mirrors and 48 million dollars a year for 16 year and over 30,000 shows for profit with no education at all !!! What a shame !!! Can you imagin what we at TIGERHOMES would do with that kind of money ???

I am so sick of these types of show with animals where the people line their pockets and do zero education !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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vlad
Clouded Leopard
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Joined: 24 Jul 2005
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Location: Enjoying the CYBER-JUNGLE!

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Gettin' us FIRED UP Dave! Exclamation Evil or Very Mad

I have to echo Ace's sentiment - Amen to ALL that you said!

So many animals are facing extinction and suffering abuse at the hands of humans, in part, because too many of us measure success purely in dollar amounts - or because too many of us are "easy marks," looking for the next thrill. And there are plenty of people who know that we are willing to PAY for it without thinking about the cost to the animals.

That type of wrong thinking continues to have a HUGE negative impact on the future of these animals who face extinction from their wild habitats, or as an alternative - suffering, and neglect or abuse at the hands of ill-informed human caretakers who, while they may appreciate the beauty of big cats, don't understand their complex needs.

As you pointed out - the "entertainment" animals rarely reap the benefits they should from being forced into the public eye on a continual basis. Even if some of these "animals entertainers" DO reap benefits from their exploitation - few, if any of these mega-bucks made will find their way to organizations which exist solely for the benefit of animals. Too often, the needs of those who are really trying to educate the public through increased awareness and appreciation for wildlife - end up as neglected as those of the animal entertainers.

Everything that is priceless cannot be measured in dollars. The cost to these beautiful creatures, when they are made to perform or are displayed for our pleasure, and ultimately someone's profit - makes their exploitation a really uneven trade-off! Some things in this world are truly priceless! I count the big cats amoung the world's treasures.

They are quite entertaining just the way they are. Big cats never existed for our entertainment in the first place. They deserve to be treated with appreciation and dignity. Our mental posture towards these awesome predators should be one of respect & humility. After all - apart from our weapons & modern-day technology - we would most certainly be on their menus! Twisted Evil

On that note - here's an article on the suffering of big cats in the name of "entertainment" or "education" posted on the Big Cat Rescue. website It is a loooooooooong article. Shocked It includes a slide-show & a "Hall of Shame" which provides more details of you click on a name. They are FIRED UP Mad about this too!

http://www.bigcatrescue.org/bigcatexhibition.htm
Credit: Big Cat Rescue Article entitled: Educators or Exploiters

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tigerdave
Ocelot
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Joined: 07 May 2004
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Location: where all the animals are !

PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
WoW i just read all of that and could not agree more !!! that why we don't breed our cats nor do we do anything other then take care of them !!!!

I have been to bigcat rescue when it was call Wildlife on Easystreet and it made me sick but they have come along way from those days and are for sure doing a great thing and have somthing good to say !!! But they used to sell their Cats but those days are long gone once the wife took over and her husband turned up missing and that when things stated to take a good turn for the best and I was there when the changes were starting to happen but it been a while since I been back !!! I been wanting to go back there with Alex and Jason because it's only about a 4 hour ride for us and I been wanting to see all the impovements and to see their AWESOME animals that are in their awesome care NOW and check out all the habitats !!! I have heard only good things and I was there when things were in the beginning stage of making all the impovements and it was looking so awesome so I am sure now it is really off the CHARTS and would be a real treat for us and alot of fun and most likely one of the BEST Sanctuaries that we will get a chance to visit !!!! To this day I get their newletters each month that been coming to me for years now !!!

My hat is off to them and they are the real deal and do an AWESOME job !!!!
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hazelmharris1
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Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 749
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 5:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have been on that site a few times and think its just great what they are doing for the animals....and i also found something interesting on there which i think could benefit tigerhomes a great deal ..i dont know if dave would be interested but i think its something worth thinking about......They have put there stuff on ebay..adoptions and keyrings and a few other things to get money in to the sanctuary.. i think it is a great fundrasing idea...but the downside is the ebay fees...they may work out more to pay than actually what you would make for the sanctuary...anyway i thought it was a good idea and wanted to let you know about it. I have included the link so you can have a look for yourself...just to get the idea..



http://stores.ebay.com/Big-Cat-Rescue
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sorry for itself.
A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough
without ever having felt sorry for itself.

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tigerdave
Ocelot
Ocelot


Joined: 07 May 2004
Posts: 3579
Location: where all the animals are !

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 7:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Great idea !!! Yes we know about that and of course know about e-bay ! We have been thinking about some other ways and e-bay might work for us !!! We have had our DVDs there and sold a few !!! But the adoption cert and glossy might ever do better !!! This will be a job for Jason since he a e-bay NERD !!! hehe !!!
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hazelmharris1
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Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 749
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
HAHAHAHA...Dave yep i am an ebay nerd too...hehehe great stuff...i had a feeling you had already had the idea.. Razz Excellent stuff..I would certainly add you as a favourite seller and have all my family and friends do that too... Razz

this would be great for you guys
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I never saw a wild thing
sorry for itself.
A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough
without ever having felt sorry for itself.

D. H. Lawrence
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Janice
Baby Iguana
Baby Iguana


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 23
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I knew of someone who belonged to their fan club of S&R. They had the audacity to ask for money for an orphange of Siegfried's sister Dolores. They are worth millions. What more can I say, she left. I also have seen the site of Easystreet. Shameful!!!! Sad What do most of you think of Tippi Hedren's site Shamabala???
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tigerdave
Ocelot
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Joined: 07 May 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have never gone to it but tonight i will take a look !!! I did hear about the crazy movie she made and have seen the making of it and how alot of people got hurt durning filming and what did they expect was going to happen !!! CRAZY !!!!!!
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